Brexit Thread IV - Negotiations begin (and we're all screwed)


#741


#742

Someone should photoshop “BREXIT” onto the ship and BRITAIN’S FUTURE onto the destroyed building, bit of satire.


#743

wigboat


#744

This is definitely not a sinister front page, no sir


#745

sigh


#746

Think of the boost to ruddy, bloody great British components manufacturers!


#747

read the comments in the thread (or maybe you did)

quite illuminating

Britain is fucked if Brexit goes ahead

totally fucked


#748

I can’t help but wonder what the guy in the the thread thought who tried to make this argument and then got school.

I’m hoping a variant of “Oh god what have I done”


#749

Brexit will go ahead. There’s no if.

Will Britain be fucked? If there’s no deal at all, yes. That’s why we - both leave and remain voters - have to hope there will be a deal, even if, inevitably, it will be a lesser deal than the one the UK currently has.


#750

Thanks for this, got me reading this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Just-in-time_manufacturing which i’d never heard about before and is fascinating

we are so totally fucked


#751

I think the opposite. A catastrophic No Deal being the final option, precipitating the collapse of the government, has always been the only way that a disastrous Brexit can be avoided.


#752

This article feels a bit “Look everyone, lets tut at the idiot, racist, well-done-steak-eating, homophobe leave voters”, but there’s probably something here about why the economic arguments/facts just won’t sway the core Brexit vote.

It feels more like Brexit as an issue is part of a progressive/conservative culture war which won’t be resolved by either leaving or staying.

I guess this is what the Express/Mail/Sun and the rest have realised and why they keep pushing those buttons.


#753

Reminds me of this a bit


#754

Yeah some of the connections were important, but things like the steak issue seemed pretty elitist, for want of a better word. Like it should be obvious to all good Guardian readers what the right answer should be


#755

Nah, this will be fake news. Just scaremongering :roll_eyes:


#756

Yeah. Things like the fact that leavers are more likely to believe that homosexuality is unnatural, that climate change is nonsense, that we should ban the burka, Trump would be a great president - that stuff is actually a really good indicator of why there’s such a gulf between the two sides.

And then they go and undermine it with “yeah, and they don’t even know how to eat a steak - troglodytes eh?”


#757

Seems to be asking, has Trump popularised well-done steak?

That 23/12% figure is odd, but medium rare is still the most popular, though it would be nice to see the figures (the right answer is rare, however).

Nearly a quarter of leave voters (23%) say they prefer their steaks well done, compared with only 12% of remain voters. The most popular way to cook steak for remain voters is “medium rare”.

No idea what to do with these people though:

Six percent of both remain and leave voters say ketchup is their favourite sauce to go with a steak.


#758

I think the same thing about all of these articles that treat Leave and Trump voters as zoo exhibits, educational how-do-we-reach-these-apes that are really just excuses for the metropolitan types who read them to gawp. It’s that fucking idiots have always existed in our country. Sure they aren’t quite as outright about their bigotry; their homophobia is now ‘concerns’, their wogs and darkies have evolved into proxy issues about immigration and Islam. But that’s because the left fought a relentless culture war against them, positive action which made them grudgingly give up ground.

And that to me is key - it’s never been about trying to capture these people’s votes, about persuading them with rational arguments. It’s about getting as many other people as possible to vote against them. And for that you need to make a positive case for something, rather than define yourself by not being them, an entreaty to authority and the status quo, which is what Clinton and the Remain campaign did. In a world gone as badly to shit as this, that no longer works. They may be horribly fascinating to us, but there’s a limit on how much there is to be gained by putting arseholes underneath the microscope.


#759

So bankers will have free movement after brexit say Davis. I’m pretty sure it’s not going to work like that…

https://www.ft.com/content/9e637940-c95a-11e7-ab18-7a9fb7d6163e


#760

same with trump, the fact that he’s not actually built a wall or whatever is fine compared to the bigger issue, the fact that you feel the president has validated your bigotry