Yes, but impossible to know how many were ticketless. I’m sure loads were, but that looks like more people than were in the crowd at venue. Seems unlikely, especially on the third night? I dunno.
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That’s the video I referred to, but we don’t know a) at what point in the night that video was taken, b) how many people were in the venue at that point and hence c) how many of those visible people don’t have a ticket. And that’s not an exhaustive list of what we don’t know.
I get that individuals who attempted to gain access without a ticket (and may have used force to do so) should be held accountable, but I’d have thought/hoped that we’d have learned to reserve judgement in light of how similar incidents have been misrepresented, in part because of partial, decontextualised evidence.
Gone unsaid in this thread so far and I’m not accusing anyone of anything, but I think that withholding of judgement is particularly important given the ethnicity of the overwhelming majority of people involved and broader racist narratives about, for example, criminality, aggression and so on.
(Edited out an auto-correct typo)
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Are you suggesting that’s what people are doing in this thread?
Am I suggesting what? Your question isn’t very clear, but I’m going to guess you’re asking if I’m doing exactly what I already said I wasn’t doing (accusing people of being racist). I’d have said a similar thing if we were talking about, for example, football fans (typically characteristised as drunk, violent etc.) in a crush outside a football stadium. How often has initial reporting about who is “to blame” in those situations differed pretty starkly from what the final totality of evidence suggests?
It’s happened, of course. I can’t think of such an incident happening after an artist has specifically gone out of their way to ask people without tickets to not attend a show though?
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Neither can I, and like I said there are individuals here who are accountable for their own behaviour irrespective of any potential organisational failing. I’d maintain, though, that we’re all better off not reaching firm conclusions or opinions until more is known. I don’t think a few 30 second social media videos tell us much more than that this was fucking terrifying. Not looking for beef or an argument or to accuse people of anything.
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Sure, I get you.
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Rescheduled to Feb, unsurprisingly.
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That’s a shame, can imagine people will have been coming from all over for that – I had briefly considered getting the train down from Glasgow and might do in Feb depending on my finances.
(Goes without saying that’s a small issue in the wider picture obvs)
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Crowd crushing seems to be happening more often recently. Saw some horrific footage of the crush in Seoul at Halloween. Has made me more aware of the dangers and how quickly it can become dangerous. Once people density goes above a certain number per square metre (I can’t remember what, maybe 8) a crowd behaves like a liquid and your feet won’t even be touching the floor. Just have to go with it and hope you’re fortunate enough to find a way out, and that no one falls over whilst it’s in that state, as that’s how the crushing/pile up happens.
BBC now have a timeline. Still lots of unknowns but looks like the crush happened after they tried to stop anyone coming in. No mention of ticketless fans, so I guess that is currently uncorroborated.
There was a video two nights ago I believe it was showing brawls inside involving at least 10 people and it looked dodgy then. Surprised following nights went ahead in some ways. Other venues like a club or pub would be shut down if that happened on such a scale inside.
Heart is racing just reading these tips and imagining being in that situation.
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Awful.
Could’ve killed them.
Such terrible news. Feel awful for Asake too, must be really hard not to feel some responsibility even if it’s ultimately not your fault at all.
So awful. I’ve been in huge outdoor gigs where this kind of thing felt possible (the article @Tartuffe linked to has a video of an Oasis gig in it that brought back some memories), but I would just never consider this if I was going out to a <5000 capacity city venue.
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This is so tragic
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Christ I’ve seen that video before without knowing it was Oasis in Manchester 2005, possible I was literally in that crowd