#3324

Pretty sure that, knowing a bit about how you view politics, if you were to listen to someone better-informed than me you would agree with it (not trying to tell you what you think, but it’s progressive in this context)

#3326

Only the Lib…

1 Like
#3327

Your butter is divided equally among your household.

4 Likes
#3328

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#3329

how do separatist movements and the right to national self-determination fit in with my socialist ideals of one international working class? Maybe some kind of union of european nations to mandate universal rights to all?

#3331

Greens in Scotland are pro Indy so it’s not that much of a leap. To vote Green and Yes bypassing SNP.

1 Like
#3332

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7 Likes
#3333

How do you know if Theresa May is in Jeremy Corbyn’s fridge?

She’s parked her tanks on his prawns

[Ed - you’re banned]

2 Likes
#3334

Yes

1 Like
#3335

Fair, can’t even remember if I voted Green or SNP in a few of mine anyway. Just made for a fun contrast mostly.

2 Likes
#3336

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#3337

UK separatist movements tend to be more closely aligned with the interests of the working class (partially because they often represent areas that are worse off than the Tory shires [for a variety of reasons, some of which are to do with the Tory shires impoverishing them through centuries of oppression]).

1 Like
#3339

yeah I guess I just get wary when I see people with any kind of flag painted on their faces, have to remember it doesn’t quite have the same implications as seeing the England flag or Union Jack

1 Like
#3340

Fixed this for you.

3 Likes
#3342

Case by case ting innit. People here often mistake the Catalan independence movement as left wing, when in fact, it’s leadership and most of its followers are right wing neoliberals. One of its leaders (the current president of the region) believes that the rest of Spain is genetically inferior to Catalans too.

2 Likes
#3343

Yeah, the England flag and Union Jack have been signs of oppression and imperialism for a very long time. This is of course not to say that all English people are bad (I’m English, maybe I’m the bad guy), but the historical case is definitely there. In Wales, in Ireland, in Scotland, in Catalunya, the Basque country, just to give some examples.

@profk Obviously the leadership can be, um, swivel-eyed eugenicist lunatics. Doesn’t mean there isn’t a historical basis!

#3344

well in broader terms not really, how do you identify who is or isn’t welsh or scottish or english etc? whati s a nationality? where you are born? your genes? dodgy ground

#3346

yeah which is why socialism needs to be an international movement not about national identity

#3347

Almost there…

1 Like
#3348

Definitely heard this sort of view given by other people (including on here before), and I do understand it. However one of the main issues with that from my POV is that getting to achieving one international working class will take a long time. Scotland (or other similar countries) becoming independent in the meantime has the potential to improve lives in that country in the present day.

And then with something like Brexit, Scotland as a whole voted to remain part of a larger group. by being so tied into the UK though the agency to make that choice was lost, so the hope is that by being independent there would actually be more ability to engage in worldwide international spaces without your positions being held back by a Government that doesn’t “truly” represent your people.

Very rough and ready, and lots of assumptions and positive spin on that, but that’s at least some of the concepts involved.

4 Likes