as a result of this thread i’m now shopping for a stovetop kettle

Me+MsWza+MiniWza

Used to be £35pm from Co-Op in a 2000s build 2 bed flat surrounded by other flats to the sides and above and below.

Seems to have averaged out at £90pm from EDF for Sep/Oct/Nov in this 1890s build 3 bed ground floor corner tenement flat. Two bands lower on council tax (which is stupid, but hey ho) and waaay less on management fees for the common areas, though, so it evens out.

With EDF cos that’s who the previous owner was with and continuity was easier. Will go back to Co-Op or someone fully renewable when we have readings for a full 12 month period.

Not sold on smart meters at all. As marckee notes, the fabric of your building is gonna be a huge determinant, and a real time bill calculator is gonna do naff all to improve that. I don’t need reminding about turning lights off. A monthly summary is just fine for keeping track of usage.

I am very sold on the Hive thermostat we’ve just had to replace the old vaguely (but hardly) programmable one that had died. Highly recommended for having proper control over the temperature monitoring and on-and-offness of your central heating. Very easily installed. Boss.

Argh, my posts are all too long today.

So I looked into it, and apparently our supplier is still planning on installing first-gen (SMETS1) meters. Given that we’re probably going to switch supplier soon, I told them we’d only be interested if they were installing a second-gen (SMETS2) one.

I’ve read a lot of boring shit on the internet in my time, but I reckon this might top the lot.

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I thought that you were football thread regular…

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fucking marckee.

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No way I’m letting marckee nab that accolade.

Hang on…

I’ve gone back and re-read the Which? guides to these smart meters, and every sentence reveals a new angle on what an absolute shitshow the whole thing is.

"While there will be no upfront charge to customers being transferred to a smart meter, the cost of installing smart meters in the national roll-out is estimated at £11bn. There are concerns that this will ultimately be passed on to customers through their energy bills."

“Concerns”. Pffft. The costs absolutely will be passed on to customers.

"You will also have a choice about how your energy consumption data is used, apart from where it is required for billing and other regulated purposes."

Aye, that’ll be respected.

"You can also decide whether your supplier can use your meter reads for sales and marketing purposes. You will also be able to share data with third parties (such as switching sites) if you want them to give you advice on the best tariff for you."

One overlooked tickbox away from a never ending supply of junk mail, then.

"These early SMETS1 meters are currently unable to connect to the central data body, called the Data Communication Company (DCC)…"

Good one, Clive. Oh, hang on, there’s a ‘central data body’, too? What could possibly go wrong…

"If you got a smart meter before the official roll-out or are considering getting a smart meter before SMETS2 meters are available, you may want to be aware of the following: 1) If you want to switch supplier, your new supplier might not be able to operate your meter in ‘smart’ mode. This may mean your meter won’t work in smart mode anymore, so will become ‘dumb’. As a result, you will need to revert to taking meter readings & 2) Your supplier may need to upgrade your meter between 2017 and 2020 if the smart meter installed is not compliant with the official roll-out specification"

Brilliant. Nothing says ‘smart’ like fucking up the job at the first try and having to do it all over again.

"Smart meters also offer additional possibilities for the future – such as improved ‘time-of-day tariffs’ offering cheaper rates at off-peak times to smooth out national energy usage through the day."

Or, y’know, shit ‘time-of-day tariffs’ offering expensive rates at peak times to maximise national energy company profits through the year.

"Between 2016 and 2020, energy companies will replace every meter in Great Britain. That’s 53m meters in total, at a cost of £11bn."

…which customers will be paying for.

"The government estimates that the smart meter roll-out will save energy companies about £8bn over 18 years through operational savings such as meter readings. Energy providers should then, in principle, pass on these savings to consumers."

So, 18 years down the line, they won’t have created operational savings to cancel out the installation costs? Yeah, energy companies will be falling over themselves to lower charges.

"Consumers are predicted to also collectively save £4.3bn through energy savings at home. However, smart meters will only save you money if you use and act on the information provided by your in-home display to reduce your energy consumption. According to government estimations, smart meters will help to reduce electricity usage by around 2.8% and gas use by around 2% on average. This could save £15 on electricity bills and £12 on gas bills a year."

“Could” save £27 a year. If you’re diligently monitoring and reacting to the smart meter’s readout.

"While having a smart meter installed is free, you’ll incur the cost indirectly through your bills. It’s estimated that the smart meter roll-out will cost every home about £215."

So definitely no benefit to the customer for two years, basically. And reliance on the goodwill of the energy companies after that.

"At the moment the roll-out is being led by the energy companies, with no checks in place to make sure that costs don’t spiral. Energy suppliers will make cost savings via the roll-out, so we want suppliers to pass on these savings in full to their customers."

So absolutely no incentive for any of this to be rolled out efficiently and the customer fits the bill. So ruddy gruddy bloody SMART.

"Smart meters will need to be replaced around every 10 years – which is more often than current gas and electricity meters."

You’re fucking kidding me? 10 years and we go through this whole shitshow all over again? JFC.

"Again, your energy company will let you know when your smart meter is due to be replaced, and arrange a time and date for this to happen."

I bet they fucking will. Why miss the chance to gouge your customers. A nice little earner, this.

"A smart meter will put an end to estimated bills, so you’ll be paying for only the gas and electricity you use."

FUCK OFF. I only pay for the gas and electricity I use now. There might be a slight mismatch from one bill to the next depending on when meter readings are submitted. But, when all’s said and done, I sure as fuck don’t pay for energy I don’t use.

"It’s hoped that smart meters – when used alongside the in-home display – will help people become more aware of how much energy they’re using. So they’ll take steps to reduce their energy consumption. The organisation responsible for telling us all about smart meters, Smart Energy GB, the body responsible for consumer awareness of smart meters, ran a survey which found 85% of people with a smart meter said they had changed the way they do things at home to use less energy. But the same research found that 95% of people who don’t have a smart meter, but know what one is, had done the same in the last six months."

So knowing what a smart meter is is more effective in getting people to reduce energy usage than actually having one. What a ringing endorsement of this whole shitshow.

tl;dr - this:

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Yeah but nobody is reading that ever, m9

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Alright, bugduv.

Bryan’s!

Not correcting autocorrect here

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Scotch Power have been harassing me the last few weeks to get me to have a smart meter. Had a couple of letters, a couple of emails, 2 or 3 phone calls.

I’m not having one in any case as I’m exceedingly tinfoil hat about it, but they were an incompetent bunch o cunts with something as simple as setting up our account so they can - as they say in their country - get tae fuck if they think I’m letting them meddle with my mains supply.

Oh and to answer the original question - nearly 2 weeks later, if anyone still cares - we pay £35 a month combined for gas and elec.

Somehow our water bill is £27.something a month. Keep meaning to ring Severn Trent and query that, as according to that we’re spending more on water than fuel.

Depends on what he’s eaten!

I actually have had no real idea about this for a while. Back in April I used the British Gas website on our flat (had electricity and gas through them) and found

2016 we spent £480 total

Highest £62.50 March Average £40.05 Lowest £12.33 February

That was our gas and electricity spend high/low/average for the year 2016

In the four months at the start of 2017: £136.56

So yeah, about £40 a month on gas and electricity without any attempt to shop around. 3-bedroom flat but equally there’s no charge for the central heating or hot water in there so that’s mainly down to various tech items on (a number 24/7 like the TV boxes) and also the constant washing machine use that was hard to avoid with a daughter who really liked to have accidents. Even trying to avoid doing too many washes.

Hey @Scout and @83746725, I’m going to be switching our supplier to Bulb. Do either of you want to claim the referral credit (think it’s £50 at the moment)? If so, give me a shout in the next couple of days!

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Oooo I could do with it! I’ll send you a Facebook message