Having kids

Scared of having kids

  • I would fuck it up
  • be very fucking difficult if they were disabled, due to a real lack of support for disabled people and then who would look after them when you go

On the other hand I could do what my dad did to me and turn them into replicas of myself.

Ta :+1:

I guess two potential responses to this (valid) concern are firstly that if you bring a child into the world who you raise to be a decent, conscientious individual who makes a positive contribution to society and brings happiness to family and friends around them, then you are on a very small level making the world a little bit less horrible. Secondly, throughout history there have always been factors to make the world seem horrible or on the brink of implosion - so I don’t think we need to be defined by it or let abstract fears determine our life choices.

It’s definitely something I thought about before becoming a parent, but I came to the conclusion that there were probably reasons why my parents might have considered the world too horrible to bring a child into back when they were my age too, and I haven’t let my life be surrounded by horror. There was and is plenty of good in the world too and if you can give that person a good start then you can let them find the good things when they are old enough.

For us, parenthood has been ace so far. We’ve got a gorgeous, curious little daughter who doesn’t take any shit from anyone and has enriched our lives massively. Of course, this is just us and I’m not saying everyone has to do this to feel fulfilled though.

I always thought on some level I would want kids, but there never came a point until we actively started trying for one that I felt ready – there are always reasons why now is not quite the right time and that imagined spontaneous moment where you suddenly feel like it is probably doesn’t really happen for many people.




Do you think individuals have the power to change any of that? Even environmentalists with the biggest platforms and the most political power haven’t managed to stop this from happening. I sometimes feel guilty too, but then I think we’re all just dust in the wind and you can’t actually change anything. I think it’s difficult to the degree that it could be called impossible.

Not having children is the single most significant thing you can do to reduce your carbon footprint.

Not saying that’s a reason to opt-out of having children, of course.

That is true.

As if there’s anything not selfish about having kids.


Plenty of substance behind the claim that the world we are bringing children into now is the best world that any generation has been born into.

No, I don’t really believe any one of us can change it all. But I also think it’s very unlikely that any of us here could honestly say we weren’t part of the problem either. And when you think of what’s at stake, that’s not really going to seem good enough to future generations and our individual actions will seem incredibly selfish regardless.

I think it’s moved past the abstract stage.[quote=“ttf, post:190, topic:9415”]
Except when it comes to the environment

That’s the big thing though isn’t it. The coming climate crisis will affect everything else - forced migration will lead to economic stress and eventual war.

I’m still planning to have kids, but I think it might be because I’m in denial.

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I dunno. I don’t blame my parents for their role in creating the world I inherited. People are flawed and fallible and incapable of thinking long-term.

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I’d argue it already is. It’s the geo-political elephant in the room with regards to Syria, ISIS, the refugee crisis, the waves of anti-migrant sentiments, nationalism, the reestablishment of national boundaries etc. I think that, alongside the failing of global capitalism (of which the climate crisis is the biggest externality) it’s the biggest driver of the changes that we’re seeing right now.


I agree, I meant more so.

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Having kids means!!!

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Not sure there ever exists a perfect time to have children where everything aligns nicely.

Having kids will make you experience a range of emotions that I don’t think you will ever experience in any other situation. Mainly positive ones though there will be negative ones as well. The feelings of pure love I don’t think are achievable anywhere else.

Also don’t think the world is that horrible, in fact it’s pretty, pretty, pretty good.


But it is abstract if you don’t know whether it’s ever going to personally affect you or your progeny and whether truly global events such as nuclear apocalypse or some kind of environmental tipping point are going to happen in the lifetime of any children you might have. Until this is guaranteed, you risk making real world decisions based on problems they might only potentially experience. I’m really glad that my parents didn’t decide on my behalf that the world was too unpleasant and the future was to bleak for me to have even had a crack at life. Of course, if they had decided they just didn’t want children, then that would have been a different issue they were perfectly within their rights to have made.

As @ttf says there are metrics which argue we’ve never had it better, and if you are born in the West to parents with a degree of security, then this is probably the case and could continue to be for a good while yet.

Besides, if global catastrophe does come to pass, you may be giving them front row seats for the end of times. In which case they’ve nothing to lose so you might as well give them the opportunity to look around and enjoy themselves for a while first. There’ll be nothing else to do after.


What if you end up in a The Road situation though.

For me, the key word there is ‘if’ because you are then restricting your life choices on the basis of hypothetical scenarios. A similar analogy would be never going on a foreign holiday because what if the plane crashed or ISIS hijacked the ferry. The danger is that by basing real world decisions on these worries, in 60 years time you’re lying on your deathbed with none of this having come to pass and you think “hmm, I could have had a child after all.”

If a Road like situation comes to pass, then so be it and you deal with it then - but at the risk of sounding like some kind of awful motivational speaker, I just don’t think you should let your life or your real, true actual life choices be determined by fear.


This is it really. I worry a lot when I’m in my more pessimistic moods but I would hate myself if this scenario came to pass and I’d denied myself something I’ve always wanted very much. You only get one life (YOLO).

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