I like them in small doses and never as much as I think I’m going to. ā€˜Treasure’ is the best album I’ve heard but I still only quite like it. Really don’t get on with ā€˜Heaven Or Las Vegas’.

Feel like a 3.5 but I’m going to round down to 3.

Can’t begin to explain what an important band they were to me, one of my favourite bands of all time. Shame I can only give them a 5. My signed Moon and the Melodies is my most treasured musical possession. They could be utterly sublime live, although sometimes could be a bit temperamental. Still among the best.

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Their lyrics are better than anyone who ever actually tried to write lyrics

Sub poll: Heaven or Las Vegas is as good as Loveless

  • Yes
  • No

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He’s a typing…

I always post this song when Cocteau Twins come up, but I’m doing so again. Circling Girl is one of the last things they ever did and it’s utterly perfect, and the unofficial video (made years later) is perfect too

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no it is better

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A lot better. The Cocteaus released three albums that are better than Loveless (and I love Loveless)

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The elite choice

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Although I love them, I can see where this sort of criticism would come from in relation to some of their stuff. Doesn’t apply at all to the earlier records though.

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you always round up if its 3.5

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(Don’t worry, it’s not an 8,000 word essay this time)

Cocteau Twins are by far the most important band of my late adult life; I only discovered them three or four years ago and of all the new/new-to-me music I’ve heard in the last decade, they’re pretty much the only band I’ve fallen completely head-over-heels in love with, like teenage obsession levels of love. They were at the end of their active years when I was young, but obviously they’d fallen completely out of fashion in the mid-90s because I don’t reecall reading a single word about them in the music press despite being an avid Vox/Select etc reader in 1996, when Milk & Kisses came out. I think the first CT material I got was Tiny Dynamine and Echoes In A Shallow Bay, and they really didn’t strike me as being particularly interesting. But for some reason I got Heaven or Las Vegas as well, and then things clicked.

At their best, Cocteau Twins have written some of the most swooningly gorgeous, life-affirming music I’ve ever heard. Liz Fraser’s voice is a force to be reckoned with; she’s easily one of the greatest singers of all time, and it’s no surprise my favourite CT songs are those where choirs of multi-tracked Lizzes coo and sweep and soar over each other. I’d also take Robin Guthrie over Kevin Shields when it comes to baffling and otherworldly guitar noises, because his are prettier.

Still, I have reservations and ever-so-slightly hot takes on Cocteau Twins some have disagreed with in the past. I don’t think they ever released a perfect album - the early contenders are a little too goth and have too much of that boomy 80s sounds I find a little jarring, and all of their canon classics contain songs I find pretty boring and skippable. They’ve also released a surprisingly large amount of outright boring material - the aforementioned Tiny Dynamine and Echoes In A Shallow Bay still do pretty much nothing for me, and Four Calendar Cafe is mostly nondescript beige. Usually a band have to release at least one perfect album for me to award a 5, and Cocteau Twins haven’t done that. They do have five or six very good to near-perfect albums, which puts them as close to a 5 as you can possibly get without actually reaching it —

And then I take into account their non-album singles. My goodness, this is where Cocteau Twins grab that five and run away with it. Sunburst and Snowblind. The Spangle Maker. Aikea-Guinea. Love’s Easy Tears: four of the greatest EPs ever made, fifteen songs of utter perfection and only one of them made it onto a studio album. Later singles with throwaway yet stellar B-sides most bands would die to write once in their lifetime. My commuting Cocteau Twins playlist (a mixture of my favourite singles, B-sides and album tracks) is always slightly in flux; it’s usually about 2.5 hours long and it’s probably the greatest 2.5 hours of music I’ve ever heard. Other bands exceed them by far in the depth of A-grade material they produced, but I’m not sure anybody has bettered my core ā€˜canon’ of CT songs (not even Spiritualized or R.E.M., which for me is pretty much the most praise I can offer)

Some album thoughts:

Garlands: I should listen to this more. It’s not bad, it’s just not really my thing. I’m not a huge fan of goth or post-punk as genres, so yeah, it leaves me a little cold. I see the promise, but it’s not there yet.

Head Over Heels: I appreciate this album more and more as time goes on. The songs are uniformly excellent, but the sound is still a bit too harsh, stereotypically abrupt and gated 80s for me to truly love it. Sugar Hiccup is pretty much the perfect song. Utter heaven.

Treasure : getting closer to perfect, and sounding a lot more otherworldly than the last two albums. When I think of the highlights — Ivo, Lorelei, Aloysious, Donimo — I understand why people consider this their greatest album, but for me there’s a couple too many dull moments mid-to-late album to earn that accolade.

Victorialand: really, really, really good, one of their most consistently wonderful listens, yet for some reason my brain doesn’t quite count it as a proper CT album, perhaps because Simon Raymonde is elsewhere. Still, Lazy Calm and Fluffytufts in particular deserve slots on any greatest CT song list.

The Moon and the Melodies: I am very fond of this album, but I can’t really highlight any individual songs as standouts, and again, it doesn’t properly count as part of their canon in my mind.

Blue Bell Knoll : This is much closer to the perfect CT sound I’m looking for, and apart from a couple of slight songs in the middle, it’s a hugely strong album. Liz’s voice spiralling ever upward in Athol-Brose, Carolyn’s Fingers ’ chorus, the lullaby beauty of For Phoebe Still A Baby, the (most perfect ever) key-change at the end of Ella Megalast Burls Forever … the best moments here are among their best moments full stop.

Heaven Or Las Vegas: Again, so close to being perfect but falling short. Why? ā€˜cos sorry, but Fifty-Fifty Clown and Road, River and Rail fall far below the standard the rest of the album sets. I’ll have to whisper it, but Cherry Coloured Funk is pretty overrated as well. But if you could distil giddy joy into musical form, the end result would be Iceblink Luck, Heaven or Las Vegas and Fotzepolitic, and Frou-Frou Foxes in Midsummer Fires is a deeply haunting, almost traumatic ending to the album.

Four Calendar Cafe: mostly dull, but Bluebeard is a lovely song and Pur is up there with their best. I like the B-sides better, particularly Mud & Dark and Summerblink, which are both so colossally superior to their parent single it’s hilarious.

Milk & Kisses: another possibly controversial opinion: this isn’t the best Cocteau Twins album, but it’s probably my favourite. It’s not even close to ground-breaking, but it’s a near-flawless set of songs recorded in a mid-90s style my ears find much easier to get on with than their early 80s material. There’s only one duff song on the album - Ups - and I set the best material up there with all of their canon classics. Violaine and Tishbite are incredible songs, two of their greatest singles, Half-Gifts is so harrowing yet hopeful it hurts, Treasure Hiding is one of the best album-closers-that-doesn’t-actually-close-an-album I can think of, and the actual closer - Seekers Who Are Lovers - is another heartbreaking masterpiece.

Anyway, that’s probably enough for now. Cocteau Twins are one of the most baffling, intriguing and downright wonderful bands I’ve ever heard, and despite flaws I’d normally associate with a 4-level band, their high points are so impossibly high — at its greatest, higher than any other music reaches — they can’t get anything less than a big ol’ 5 from Ella. I didn’t change my username to a bastardised (and cooler) version of a CT song for nothing, and my best bike shares the same appellation :slight_smile:

Oh yeah, happy new year BTW

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1/5 from what I’ve heard. Hate the vocals sounds like some manic pixie dream girl film nonsense

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Nice, glad you didn’t burn yourself out writing a book too! Enjoyed reading that thank you.

I have not heard everything by them, far from it. What I have heard and what you pick up on so well is Akiea-Guinea and Garlands, which I love.

I recall seeing an ad in Sounds that they were playing 40 miles away whilst I was 15 and still at school. I’d just started going to gigs and was trying to work out if I could walk there!

Generous maybe as I’ve not heard everything but they feel like a 5 to me. A layer of magic most artists get nowhere near.

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ah you always say that!

yeah, you sometimes say that tbf

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Another possibly controversial, slightly negative CT opinion: I’ve not heard a great deal of their music live (I get the impression they didn’t tour much) and if I’m honest, I don’t actually get on with a lot of what I have heard. I love Liz’s wordless, glossolia singing style on record, and although I don’t usually have a friggin clue what she’s saying or trying to get across, I always feel like she’s singing something concrete. Nothing I can grasp, but concrete nevertheless. In a lot of the live recordings I’ve heard, she breaks away from her usual vocals and does a kind of scat shooby-dooby-doo-wah singing thing I can’t help but think is a bit… lazy? Maybe it’s because she can’t possibly recreate the multi-tracked vocals on stage by herself, or maybe she really does sing whatever syllables take her fancy at any moment in time, but yeah… for me, it works far better on record.

Edit: that said, the live version of Pur @dktrfaustus posted is utterly perfect

happy for you that you like them and maybe if my life had turned out different I would too but it didn’t and I don’t

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Love Liz Frazer’s work with Massive Attack, but have tried a few times with Cocteau Twins and just do not get it. Sounds like Enya by way of run-of-the-mill 80s indie to my ears and I am absolutely certain that I have missed the point. Makes me sad, but there it is.

2/5 because they obviously aren’t shite, but subjectively I just don’t enjoy the sound they make.

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Easiest 5 yet!

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So hope this was an intentional pun… enjoyed it even if not

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