Is it wrong to wear a white poppy?


#121

Oh my god


#122

Thank you, sir, for proudly wearing your poppy to remember…[checks notes]…our honoured war dead.
image


#123

:thinking:


#124

idk about poppies, but i can’t in good conscience find anything to respect about world war 1. it was a stupid, pointless war, and every side was proto-fascist and horrible. there’s nothing to admire in any of it. it was a series of rolling massacres that ultimately birthed every horror of the 20th and 21st centuries. it took another world war just to resolve some of the problems it caused. when people say they’re wearing a poppy to honour “the sacrifice” of the soldiers, i have no idea what that even means.


#125

I believed the view that WW1 was a pointless, inhumane and murderous exercise is shared by many who fought in it. I’m not saying the message isn’t twisted to effectively whitewash the crimes perpetrated by the British army…but I think there are (or at least were) many who were involved in a bloodbath against their will. This feels like a simplistic point, and on a base level I know you’re not really questioning this point, but for me there is still scope for people to honour those killed because of gross callousness in higher ranks


#126

Must we go through this every fucking year. Just leave the man alone.


#127

The actual soldiers were conscripted from 1916. Men of serving age were harrassed in the streets and threatened with prison, death or being disowned by their local community.
The officers didn’t even see them as human.

To be clear I’d never wear a poppy and have a good understanding of British colonialism.
Don’t forget that the voting laws didn’t change until after the war started and most of the conscripts wouldn’t have been able to vote before then, therefore had no choice but to go

Have you listened to Dan Carlin’s hardcore history “countdown to Armageddon” series. It’s long but worth it


#128

i have, agree it’s very good, and i agree with your post here. what you say about conscription and treatment of pacifists is what i mean when i say i don’t understand the “remember their sacrifice” thing. they were sacrificed by their governments, seems to me many of them didn’t have much say in it. yet i’m pretty sure that isn’t what our leaders want us to remember. and the ones who happily went down to the recruiting office to fight for god and country - and we have to remember not all of them were pressed into service initially, a lot of them were eager little nationalists - found out pretty quickly what a modern war looked like and didn’t want any part of it after the first couple of months, but were forced to keep killing and dying.

your harry patches and such, and the price paid by socialists throughout europe for opposing the war, get more marginalized every year, and now it’s the awful, tacky authoritarian types who are in control of the narrative amd how we remember it. makes me really uncomfortable.


#129

much like me mam, i’ll buy a poppy but not wear it


#130

Yeah no ones saying that you have to be comfortable with it but saying there isn’t anything to respect about WW1 seems a bit of a stretch. Literally millions of people who wanted nothing to do with it were forced to their death by the rich and powerful. Respecting those lives lost seems worth while to me


#131

of course, but we have to make sure we we emphasise that ww1 is what happens when nationalism and bad leaders are allowed to set the world on fire. i’m certainly not singling britain out here, either, because every country was awful.

imo we should also honour the russian revolutionaries whose overthrow of the tsar helped speed up the end of the war and scared europe and america enough for them to make more democratic concessions to their people. regardless of what we think of what happened later, October 1917 was, for me a good thing.


#132

i think we’re talking at cross purposes. i mean the war itself is what i can’t respect. ofc i can find plenty to respect at a micro level. the pacifist movement, every soldier who reached across to the other side to share food or cigs or pamphlets, every soldier who clipped their CO instead of obeying suicidal orders, i have nothing but respect for them. and as i mentioned harry patch and others who were brave enough to call it as they saw it and suffered a lot for telling the truth.


#133

Cool.


#134

he’s now under investigation from the FA for the ‘uneducated cavemen’ jibe in that post :frowning:


#135

of course. because as someone on dis pointed out t’other week, life itself has at this point jumped the shark.

summon the nukes.


#136

Saddest thing is that the Romanovs are now deified as literal saints. This reminds me I need to go see the exhibition at my work.

Anyway, I was strong-armed into getting a poppy, but now I feel like a chump for wearing it. I flip-flop between ghosthalo and safebruv. I don’t respect the war, but I also don’t want the working class boys forced to fight and die horrifically to be forgotten.

Whole thing is a fucking mess tbh m9


#137

Aaron’s been seemingly a bit quiet recently, but he’s back now with the richest, creamiest takes


#138

Until recently Aaron was one of my CLP officers, and barely showed up to any meetings or did anything, and actually meant some of the positive stuff we could be doing was held back


#139

glad he exists though


#140

Probably because he’s been writing his book. I dunno. Either way if you’ve not got the time to serve on your CLP, just don’t bother eh?