Thank you from the bottom of my heart, David Pajo.

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Sometimes I fantasise (alright, calm down Ian Brown) about DMing him a link to this thread on Instagram because you just know he’d read the whole damn thing and the fallout would be incredible.

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Please, please, please don’t, that’s my worst nightmare.

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Think Pajo came across as the tool in that situation. It was 1979, and it played out like an indie snob being “pfff, I’ve never even heard that.”

Oh do! That would be BRILLIANT!

I owe you a big response, one that I probably don’t have time for today unfortunately, but I can assure you I’m not confusing the two (though they do inevitably end up being related). I’m hoping ttf has some examples too if he comes back to the thread.

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I think the length is perfect, though I love long, sad albums. I think if it got shortened it would lose its atmosphere / flow - it needs a long build-up to that final stretch, which is the best four song sequence anyone has ever released as far as I’m concerned.

Much more coming in the future, but I just wanted to point out a couple things. Many reviews of his music - both new and old - are nothing more than hit pieces which demonstrate the reviewer hates Billy Corgan and was excited to rip him apart, and probably barely even listened to the album. They get downright mean. Off the top of my head Pitchfork and The Quietus have some particularly mean-spirited and aggressive ones, and I know there are many more but I’m getting wound up and have to go in a few minutes.

I thought The AVClub did a very tasteful criticism of Monuments to an Elegy when it was released. While I disagree with certain things said in the review, it clearly wasn’t coming from a vitriolic place, and I actually thought the following passage from it was spot on and good writing:

Unfortunately, the album’s lyrics also skew toward New Order’s notoriously banal writing. Songs make sweeping statements and anthem-worthy proclamations, but never go beneath the surface to explain why listeners should be inspired. “Being Beige” asks, “The world’s on fire, so have you heard?” while “Monuments” revolves around the elementary-school-level couplet “I feel alright tonight / And everywhere I go is shining bright”—and then repeats the phrase, “Alright, alright, alright” throughout for added emphasis. Even the urgent “One And All”—which proclaims “One and all / We are, we are so young / We’re young, we’re young” on the choruses—never really explores this rabble-rousing insinuation with any depth. This thematic emptiness is disappointing, because Smashing Pumpkins’ complexity is part of the band’s appeal; even the overstuffed (or unsuccessful) moments are at least admirably adventurous or enigmatic. And so while Monuments To An Elegy is certainly a solid release, in the end, it’s most enjoyable when approached with managed expectations.

Compare that to Pitchfork’s review of Machina, which makes objectively ludicrous statements (saying Adore and Machina are basically the same thing, for instance - regardless of whether or not you enjoy the albums, this is a preposterous claim and demonstrates the reviewer barely listened to both) and has an overall nasty tone and even insults Billy Corgan’s appearance for no reason.

On a side note, it’s very interesting to me that Corgan’s appearance has always been and continues in 2019 to be fair game. Even in the movie thread today people are taking shots at the way he looks, whereas if the same were done to other artists there would undoubtedly be long posts about how that’s not ok and problematic or whatever.

Can someone take my trainers off, please? My feet feel hot.

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:rofl:

Think declaring “I never even heard 1979” reeks of classic indie snobbery, especially given his shitty attitude and behavior towards Corgan.

I don’t think there was any suggestion in that interview that Pajo just announced this to Corgan unprompted (he just says “When I was in Zwan, Billy got so mad at me when he found out I didn’t know any Smashing Pumpkins songs”) but even if so is it not still a little bit more embarrassing to get annoyed that somebody hasn’t heard your music?

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What if he’d never heard 1979.

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I’ve heard 1979 but I can imagine a world where I might not have heard 1979

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It’s quite dull tbh

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Not entirely confident that I’ve heard Disarm (I’m sure I probably have though)

I didn’t recognise it from its title but listened to it a couple of weeks ago. It is good but it’s also peak annoying corgan whiny voicd

I don’t even know if I’ve heard it either. I’ll listen to it later.

  • Smashing pumpkins thread
  • My vitriol thread

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Whiny’s not the right word. That over stressing every single word as if it’s so emotive and important thing