#569

I am not a pacifist (though I respect pacifism as a moral position). I think violence is sometimes justified for political reasons e.g. to fight fascism.

Anon poll:

Violence that may result in someone’s death is…

  • sometimes justified, including for political reasons
  • only justified for self defence or defence of loved ones
  • never justified

0 voters

#570

Well I hope you and your loved ones never have to live under a dictatorship.

#571

I honestly think that the US needs massive constitutional change because I think what this last 4 years have taught us more than anything is the the office of the President of the United States of America carries way too much power and that 1 person having all that power means they don’t need to give a fuck about conventions or principles because they have all that power

it’s kind of equivalent and parallel to the 2nd amendment - the difference in terms of the firepower of what was imagined in 1791 versus your AR-15 now …well, it’s the same for Presidential power

If Trumps gets his SCOTUS pick installed and/or Roe v Wade is repealed… I mean, it doesn’t bear thinking about

and it isn’t just Trump. Don’t forget that a pre-Trump America was drone strikes blowing up weddings in Afghanistan and Yemen and disappearing people to black ops torture sites and a billion other crimes

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#572

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#573

100% agree

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#574

the idea is that it does, ultimately? like I said, it’s not something easily summarised.

every legit crime (so excluding the likes of drug possession) stems from society being broken.

it’d be a gradual thing, obvs, and in practice it is more of an ideal to move towards than something that can ever fully be implimented, but the idea is that we would not have people who cannot be rehabilitated or kept from doing harm in other ways, no?

I need to read more on the topic myself, and I would advise you to do the same rather than seeking answers here!

I think this is where @Bamnan’s post upthread is sort of right: we can’t be expecting people to fully detail the sorts of things that people devote their lives to thinking about!

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#575

But I think we can expect people to give people the courtesy of backing up such a strong statement with more than a brush off.

I disagree actually that all crimes stem from a broken society, I’m not convinced that all rapes and murders would be removed by creating a fair society for people

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#576

it was a little bit weak, tbf.

I understand taking that personally, but it’s weak in the sense that people often ask others to explain a complex thing to them in glib ways?

I always try to explain where my thoughts are at when I pose a question to try and avoid bad faith reads of what I’m saying.

like… idk.

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#577

:smiley: literally responding to

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#578

same

#579

this isn’t a moral dilemma guys - he should’ve taken it seriously

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#580

why don’t you think that would solve such things?

I don’t believe it’s possible to fully rid the world of that kind of behaviour - as I said, it’s an ideal to work towards, imo - but rape and murder largely stems from our world being violent and patriarchal.

capitalism is based on survival of the fittest, which naturally results in violence. we need a better foundation than that to build on, for a start.

we also still have an awful understanding of mental health and nothing approaching a good enough system in place to prevent and support people.

idk. again: it’s really hard to summarise.

I guess I would ask you what you think the root causes of such crimes are, first and foremost. that’s what I’m trying to address.

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#581

I do wonder if him now getting it will frighten some people into complying more?
Like people I know did not take this shit seriously until Boris got ill and then it was like woah

#582

I don’t know, basic male biology in a lot of instances, a lot of crimes will just happen…because crime happens

I’ll be honest I don’t think murder and rape will ever be eradicated, ever, which brings me back to my original question of what would the alternative to prison be

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#583

It could do, it depends on how he himself responds. When Bolsonaro got it (potentially twice if rumours are to be believed) he recovered and dismissed it as a bad cold anyone could shrug off, and if Trump does that the whole effort is shot over there.

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#584

I can understand why someone would respond to something as black-and-white as ‘abolish prisons’ with ‘what’s the alternative’ though, I could actually think of far glibber responses (not that it was glib) … such as ‘good luck with that’

You said above that it’s more of a long-term ideal to work towards, which is fine and contextualises it more than a slogan. But I still think it’s an extremely shakey premise that in a just society there would be no crime.

#585

Yeah that’s true. Boris still looks fucked to be fair so I think people can see the physical toll it’s taken on him

Trump and his super human genetics means he’ll bounce back and say coronavirus was nothing, just got a bit tired etc

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#586

I wasn’t trying to be glib, it was a genuine question

#587

i know

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#588

wonder if Moker’s had any sleep this week

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