Ukraine-Russia Crisis Thread

It’s not just that - the consequences for opposing government policy can be severe:

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While this is important, even if there were no consequences for protest it’s clearly facile and awful to blame citizens for the choices of their governments, even if you have no cause to question how those governments came to power.

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Say what you like about our society and govermnent but this really makes me realise how lucky we are to live in a free society. Were sat watching football on the tv while unspeakable evil is happening not so far away. The world is a crazy, terrifying place

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To what extent I wonder are conversations happening through back channels that the media don’t know about?

Saudi Arabia’s suggestion about mediating a deal and China saying a peace agreement is needed.

We’ve had Putin, Medvedev and now Lavrov all say if the new territories are attacked then they’ll use WMDs but western leaders still publicly sleep walking in to a disaster they’re claiming is a bluff!? Surely they must be advising against counter attacks there now?

How is it any different from the last 100 times Russia intimated they’d used a nuke or whatever.

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Performance on the ground and the annexing of new territories

You’ll always find a reason if you’re desperate to believe the worst is going to happen. There were always reasons before. It was always bullshit.

For your own well-being, try and step away. Posting at 6am on a Sunday about your fears of imminent nuclear annihilation is not healthy.

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Yeah but that’s not different at all, Keyzeey. It’s exactly the same. Strikes on annexed Crimea have been happening for some fucking time, for one thing.

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Cringe

Roger Waters being Roger Waters:

BBC News - Roger Waters gigs in Poland cancelled amid Ukraine backlash

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What do we all make of these gas leaks then?

The whole thread is worth a look

Very, very troubling

I guess this is bigger news in Scandinavia than in the UK right now

Is this gas that Europe has already paid for?

It’s a little unclear

From what I understand NS2 was never fully operational but NS1 had been supplying gas to/via Germany since 2011. After Germany took over NS1 at their end in March as a sanction against Russia, Russia turned off the pump at their end. But still, both pipes were full of gas in order to maintain pressure. The unclear part is whether Germany was still pumping - or planned to have in reserve/had already paid for - the gas that is in NS1

What IS clear is that there’s no way now that a deal can be brokered to resume gas supplies via Nordstream this winter. The pipe simply wont be fixed in time

Also, it’s a potential ecological disaster

But it’s unclear who may have caused it and why

yeah, too much of a coincidence to not be sabotage…but who would sabotage/what would the motive be? Doesn’t seem to be in anyone obvious best interests.
Maybe that lad that chained himself to the goal at Everton got into scuba diving…

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It’s definitely sabotage. Swedish seismological stations picked up the explosions/detonations. One measured 2.3 on the Richter scale

Biden did threaten to blow them up back in February…so :man_shrugging:t2:

Then again, it could well be a Russian false flag as an excuse to escalate given what Biden said in Feb

Could also be a provocateur act from another interested actor to deepen the crisis or maybe even Ukrainian forces with NATO help sending a warning signal

Or maybe - given the location - it’s Russia sending a warning signal to Sweden/Finland to stay out of NATO and/or a clear fuck you to Germany. A siege action of sorts

Scary whichever way you look at it

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Could also be a cover action - an excuse for Russia to send boats to that area of the Baltic and occupy some prime tactical maritime geography under auspices of ’maintenance’ :eyes:

Makes sense that Russia would return to terrorist style attacks and ‘deniable’ military operations and interference etc. Had been working well for them over the last decade or so.

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Yep, it also has propaganda use at home in the face of mobilisation ’issues’

My money’s on a self-sabotage but I honestly wouldn’t put it past US either

What worries me though is that …well, don’t want to alarm anyone so I’ll spoiler this

A neofascist govt in Italy, a centre-far right Govt in Sweden, a Govt in the UK tanking the economy - and all 3 brand new & unsettled. An energy crisis - particularly gas- and now this. Seems like a lot of precursors for things to move very quickly in a very bad direction.

Estonia must be bricking it

It’s all very volatile & unpredictable

Just remembered that the world’s largest producer of LNG is hosting a global sports tourney this December. Nothing bad could come of that, surely

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It maybe should be added that a new Norway - Poland/Baltic pipeline opened literally today

So, sabotage & warning from Russia or sabotage & a fuck you from the ’west’ ?

:man_shrugging:t2: No idea

Still, millions of tonnes of methane are escaping into the Baltic air right now

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